|
Post by snakelady on Jul 25, 2017 7:05:23 GMT
....you only need to read Rhinos blog about the Turkey incident to see this wasn't just Frame distancing himself but also the rest of the band. .. it also attempts to taint my memories and my love of the music. And I'm scared that I might eventually find that unforgivable. I've got to admit that's something I've seen stated before, but don't understand. My memories are my memories and I love the music I love. Someone else - in this case Francis has different memories and loves different tunes. Why that should influence me is beyond me. And memories aren't absolute or facts - they actually keep changing all the time. As said before, I believe Francis mainly talks negatively about the 70s for the person he was back then - so why should that bother me or spoil the great memories I have from the time ? I was and still am somebody different and naturally I've changed too. A lot in fact. I'm convinced back then most of the time Francis loved what he was doing and it's only from today's POV that he sees the flaws and faults. Why not ? And it's certainly not by choice that some people more remember the negative while for others the positive things stick in mind. Francis has a critical stance towards his own life and achievements. He puts them into perspective and obviously not much passes the test and is deemed good enough. When he compares himself to so many other great bands and brilliant musicians out there he can't help but feel he's not good enough, doesn't actually deserve the fame and money. It's one reason why he's so desperately tried to improve over the last decades and practises so much. What he can't see is the sum of all parts that happened up there on stage, that had those of us looking up there completely blown away and mesmerized. But it's not something you can measure in objective terms - it simply happened - and it had nothing to do with the band members' abilities or musicianship. The closest the band members can probably get to understanding it, is when they're carried away by the music when playing and it flows out effortlessly. It'll always be a different perspective though. So in no way will Francis' thoughts and memories of the time influence mine. I can merely pity him, that he isn't able to remember and feel what I do. - And I'll forever be thankful what he, they, gave me. The music, the tune to my life - and nothing will ever change that.
|
|
mortified
Administrator
This is no' gettin' the bairn a shirt
Posts: 5,563
|
Post by mortified on Jul 25, 2017 7:37:06 GMT
.. it also attempts to taint my memories and my love of the music. And I'm scared that I might eventually find that unforgivable. I can merely pity him, that he isn't able to remember and feel what I do. - And I'll forever be thankful what he, they, gave me. The music, the tune to my life - and nothing will ever change that. Fair points. It is really sad, though, if Francis can't see any good in any of it. His perception of those days will naturally be different from the fans. But he's not just focusing on the negatives; he's pretty much dismissing all of it. And by doing so, he does himself, Rick, John, Alan and thousands of fans a disservice. His views come across as unbalanced. Almost no give and take. It's almost like Rick and Francis were the ying and yang of Quo history. Rick had nothing but good to say; Francis the opposite. And now he's the only voice. So we're stuck with someone telling is how $hit it all was - including the music. It's becoming tiresome. I'm not saying he can taint my memories or the music; just that it can be seen as an attempt to. I will not defend that. It's unnecessary and comes across as either dishonest or misguided. He's often gone against the grain in interviews, sometimes just for the sake of being controversial or contradictory. I get that. Especially in more recent years. I have found it amusing but seen through it. I can see through this as well. I just don't find it amusing.
|
|
|
Post by snakelady on Jul 26, 2017 7:25:12 GMT
I can merely pity him, that he isn't able to remember and feel what I do. - And I'll forever be thankful what he, they, gave me. The music, the tune to my life - and nothing will ever change that. .. I'm not saying he can taint my memories or the music; just that it can be seen as an attempt to. I will not defend that. It's unnecessary and comes across as either dishonest or misguided. .. Why should he ? Attempt to taint somebody else's memories I mean ? He talks about it how he sees and remembers it at the time of an interview, that's all. And if his mood is subdued and more negative than normal, maybe because he still misses Rick, than his views will be even darker and lean more towards the bad than usual. That's human. I tend to mainly remember bad experiences too. Not good, but there's nothing I can do about it. And I actually prefer a personality like that over a happy go lucky character, who doesn't think much and prefers to enjoy himself no matter what. I acknowledge though that the latter's life is much easier. Necessary or not doesn't come into it. We are what we are and Francis is what he is. Why should he lie just to tell people what they want to hear ? He has written some fantastic music during the time and played some blinding gigs. That's all that should matter to us ! And he's got the right to talk - to think - about the time and everything involved - part of his own life basically - the way he feels. So if interviewers don't want to hear it - ask different questions. If fans don't want to hear it - don't read it/listen to it. But to say he shouldn't talk like that just because we love the time/things he doesn't is simply wrong. If you want to hear lies and how great everything is/was - listen to politicians.
|
|
|
Post by viking55 on Jul 26, 2017 9:57:48 GMT
Francis has always had a more philosophical outlook. You just have to te-read the large ' Sounds ' interview in 79 for the release of WYW ! He always strove for a 100% percenter gig wise and never felt the Band achieved it. For me they did many a time back then. Cardiff Castle 76 was a blinder !! I agree that to dismiss everything musically is the wrong thing IMO. He should be able to seperate his personal lifestyle and talk about the Bands music and achievements as a seperate issue. Who are we to criticise ! We all have our faults.
|
|
mortified
Administrator
This is no' gettin' the bairn a shirt
Posts: 5,563
|
Post by mortified on Jul 26, 2017 13:38:13 GMT
Fair enough all round. We all have our views. But I still think he deliberately says things in interviews just out of mischief. But to pretty much dismiss the music that made he and the band famous while at the same time not even acknowledging the fact that many people very much loved it is more than just mischievous. Not once have I seen him give anyone or anything from those days any credit recently; not Rick, not the fans, no one. Not even himself. I was an idiot when I was younger. From about 15 to about 30, I could be a right prat. Like most blokes. But I wasn't all bad. That's simply the point I'm trying to make. And, to repeat myself from another thread, his comments about the British blues boom of the 60's are just plain wrong and were said just to emphasise that dismissal of Quo's 70's output. And his further comments about 'product' rather than music reveal the true and far reaching influence of Simon Porter and others like him who are involved with the band. Francis is and always was my hero. He will remain so. But he's pushing it! Not that he cares
|
|
mortified
Administrator
This is no' gettin' the bairn a shirt
Posts: 5,563
|
Post by mortified on Jul 26, 2017 15:25:06 GMT
I'm just getting fed up with the grumpy old git. My dad gets a bit detached from reality as well
|
|
|
Post by snakelady on Jul 27, 2017 7:06:06 GMT
I'm just getting fed up with the grumpy old git. My dad gets a bit detached from reality as well .. but you are aware that you're closer to Francis' age than your dad is ? Although you may have a few years left before turning into a grumpy old soandso .. Maybe though the explanation for his negativity is a really simple one: Francis is completely fed up with having to talk about that decade time and again and wants to scare people off the topic once and for all ?
|
|
mortified
Administrator
This is no' gettin' the bairn a shirt
Posts: 5,563
|
Post by mortified on Jul 27, 2017 7:31:41 GMT
I'm just getting fed up with the grumpy old git. My dad gets a bit detached from reality as well .. but you are aware that you're closer to Francis' age than your dad is ? Although you may have a few years left before turning into a grumpy old soandso .. Maybe though the explanation for his negativity is a really simple one: Francis is completely fed up with having to talk about that decade time and again and wants to scare people off the topic once and for all ? Then he should say so. I don't get the impression politeness is his strong point
|
|
|
Post by smokie on Jul 27, 2017 21:15:33 GMT
I don't know what to make of his interviews sometimes. I don't know if he does it to court controversy? (I doubt it), he's bored being asked the same questions again and again? (perhaps) or he is just being honest?
He certainly doesn't have a high opinion of some of the back catalogue and perhaps it irks him being constantly told how great some of it is when his own opinion of it is quite the opposite.
Does it come down to him being overly critical due to the fact that he regards himself as a better guitarist now and perhaps a better writer today than what he was back in the 70s and he feels the later output is more deserving of praise? (In his opinion)
I've read quotes from Francis saying his favourite single was Marguerita Time and album was Thirsty Work. Could this just be him on the defensive as these two examples have been panned by many of the "hard core" and this is just a reaction to that?
I enjoy reading his interviews as he always has something of interest to say. He's never bland.
|
|
mortified
Administrator
This is no' gettin' the bairn a shirt
Posts: 5,563
|
Post by mortified on Jul 28, 2017 5:42:03 GMT
I've read quotes from Francis saying his favourite single was Marguerita Time and album was Thirsty Work. Could this just be him on the defensive as these two examples have been panned by many of the "hard core" and this is just a reaction to that? Which is what I meant about being mischievous and deliberately saying the opposite to the common belief; amongst Quo fans at any rate. He does that. Like most of us, he can be quite contradictory. For example, in largely dismissing the 70's material, it goes against what he said when they recorded them for the Aquostic albums where he said many of them had a beautiful melody. I agree; his interviews are never dull. But are they honest? I genuinely don't know. If they are then they haven't been in the past. Can't have it both ways. All I do know is that every time he opens his mouth these days I seem to disagree with him. And we're not talking an opinion here. More a sort of "hold on, that's just not right". I also have a slight concern about his comments on Rick. He knew him better than any one of us so we can't judge too much but couldn't it just be that Rick actually was the type of singer he became because that's what he wanted to do? That he didn't have his head turned and it wasn't pretence. He may have started out with the Everly Brothers but he didn't play guitar like them so why should he sing like that? Maybe Rick was more honest with himself than anyone else in the band.
|
|
|
Post by snakelady on Jul 28, 2017 7:53:33 GMT
I've read quotes from Francis saying his favourite single was Marguerita Time and album was Thirsty Work. Could this just be him on the defensive as these two examples have been panned by many of the "hard core" and this is just a reaction to that? Which is what I meant about being mischievous and deliberately saying the opposite to the common belief; amongst Quo fans at any rate. He does that. Like most of us, he can be quite contradictory. For example, in largely dismissing the 70's material, it goes against what he said when they recorded them for the Aquostic albums where he said many of them had a beautiful melody. I agree; his interviews are never dull. But are they honest? I genuinely don't know. If they are then they haven't been in the past. Can't have it both ways. All I do know is that every time he opens his mouth these days I seem to disagree with him. And we're not talking an opinion here. More a sort of "hold on, that's just not right". I also have a slight concern about his comments on Rick. He knew him better than any one of us so we can't judge too much but couldn't it just be that Rick actually was the type of singer he became because that's what he wanted to do? That he didn't have his head turned and it wasn't pretence. He may have started out with the Everly Brothers but he didn't play guitar like them so why should he sing like that? Maybe Rick was more honest with himself than anyone else in the band. The great thing about Rick was, that he was able to cope with every situation, to find something great and enjoyable in it, no matter how lost or bad even the band were. Sometimes I thought he only formed an opinion to agree with what was happening anyway. On the other hand that meant too, that he was changing his opinion all the time. As is stated in the AAA autobiography: The grass was always greener over there for him, so he kept hopping over the fence all the time. . Interestingly enough he has always been forgiven and been loved by the fans, whereas Francis has always been crucified for every change of mind. He'll have accepted the role long ago and maybe that's another reason why he enjoys being controversial or to tell people what they not want to hear. The songs and albums he mentions are a case in point. He certainly really likes Margarita Times, but I doubt TW does much for him. He didn't play a single song from it on his solo tour and that set is more of an indicator for me what he really likes than anything mentioned in interviews. Going by his choice of Quo songs for that set I think he's got great taste actually - my personal choice would've looked very similar .
|
|
|
Post by smokie on Jul 28, 2017 8:07:08 GMT
Kris Kristofferson wrote a song with lines in it that was a comment on his friend Johnny Cash and those lines were:
He's a walkin' contradiction Partly truth, partly fiction.
Couldn't this apply to Francis and Rick too?
The contradictions with Francis have already been pointed out but what about Rick? He was honest enough with himself in the way that he lead his life but is the rock thing 100% true too? In the dvd with the featurette on Coronation Street, Rick is seen sitting with his ukulele, he talked about making a ukulele album, he wrote Mystery Island, I don't think any of these are what I would consider "rock".
Walkin' contradiction might be apt there too?
Perhaps for us all
|
|
mortified
Administrator
This is no' gettin' the bairn a shirt
Posts: 5,563
|
Post by mortified on Jul 28, 2017 9:04:38 GMT
We're all walking contradictions. No we're not. Yes we are. Yes we are.
|
|
|
Post by snakelady on Jul 28, 2017 16:18:02 GMT
Kris Kristofferson wrote a song with lines in it that was a comment on his friend Johnny Cash and those lines were:
He's a walkin' contradiction Partly truth, partly fiction.
Couldn't this apply to Francis and Rick too?
The contradictions with Francis have already been pointed out but what about Rick? He was honest enough with himself in the way that he lead his life but is the rock thing 100% true too? In the dvd with the featurette on Coronation Street, Rick is seen sitting with his ukulele, he talked about making a ukulele album, he wrote Mystery Island, I don't think any of these are what I would consider "rock".
Walkin' contradiction might be apt there too?
Perhaps for us all
Indeed, I remember Rick wanting to make a ukulele album too, but in the end not daring to go for it. And I'll always have the 70s interview with the band in mind in which they explained about the three types of Quo music: Alan would write the hard stuff, Rick would see things a lot softer and Francis would cover the middle ground. IMO Rick's rocker image merely derived from his stance on stage and not necessarily from his musical taste. Don't know about the honest with himself bit though. Maybe when it came to his private life where he seems to have been rather egocentric, but where the band was concerned Rick always went along with and got behind the decisions made by others. Confrontational he was not - which was certainly a good thing for Quo, as you need characters like him to keep a band alive. To merely have alpha types a la Alan and Francis leads to grief and splits.
|
|